The Trinity

explanation and scriptural basis of the doctrine of the Trinity. Here's a summary. God eternally exists as three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, and each person is fully God, and there is one God. And I asked Bob to bring the the marker board in here today, just to kind of get a visual picture of what we're talking about. If I take this circle to represent God, then within the Trinity, within the being of God, we have Father, Son and Holy Spirit, each person being fully God, and yet, and there is one God. But how can there be one God and three persons? That's the question. That's the question that people have pondered and reasoned about and struggled over and asked about for centuries. And I think that the Christian Church, finally at the Council of Nicea and Calcedon 325-381 came up with a good solution. It doesn't answer all of our questions. I don't think we're ever going to have all of our questions answered about the doctrine of the Trinity, but it sets out some boundaries and does say some very helpful things. So that's the question. How can this be? How can God be one being, and yet be three persons? I'm looking for an example here. I have Ev, and I'll take Mike and Ev and John here. Those are three persons. Okay, Mike, Ev and John, three persons. Great. You can get that. You can talk to Mike. You can talk to Ev. You can talk to John. They can talk to each other, three persons. You say that's fine. Each person is a human being, fine. But you say, wait a minute. They're not one being. They're three being. I see one being here, one being here, one being here. Right? Three different beings. But wait a minute. How can God be one being, and three persons? See, that's the problem. And I can say it in a kind of a simple sentence here. God is three persons, five or seven Holy Spirit, and each person is fully God, and there is one God, but then how can there be three persons? That's the problem. But as we put together dozens of verses from the Bible that talk about the Father, talk about the Son, talk about the Holy Spirit, I'm going to go through a number of these verses and say, here are verses that say the Father is God, here are verses that say the Son is God, and here are some verses that say the Holy Spirit is God. And then here are verses that say there's one God, and we find that hinted at in the Old Testament. We find it more fully revealed in the New Testament, and the authors seem content to say all of those things, but not to explain how it could be. So that's the puzzle that we'll be working on this week, and then three weeks from now, and we come back and try to finish it up. And now go through a number of the passages, and then I want to go through some wrong ideas that people have had in the history of the church. There are some heresies, subbellionism, or modalism is one, Aryanism is another, tritheism is another, and we're going to go through some of those mistakes that people have made to try to guard against that. And then there are some examples that people give. They say, oh, the Trinity is like this, or it's like the Adder, it's like that, and they take examples from our life, and maybe you've heard some of those, and they may be helpful a little bit. But what I'm going to say is, ultimately, none of those examples really solves the problem for us. So that's kind of an overview of where we're going. So you ready? Okay, here we go. The doctrine of the Trinity. The doctrine of the Trinity is progressively revealed in scripture. There's a partial revelation of this in the Old Testament. Although I don't think people at the time of the Old Testament understood very much about it. Although the doctrine of the Trinity is not explicitly found in the Old Testament, several passages suggest or even imply that God exists as more than one person. We start out, Genesis 126, then God said, let us, what's this word doing here? Us. Let us make man in our image after our likeness. Those are plurals, and they're plural in the Hebrew text as well,

who's God talking to, and let them have dominion, et cetera.

It's a problem. I want to spend several days, three or four days, maybe, drinking most of the day, going through all the comments of the Jewish rabbis on this verse. This is comments that were written after the time of the Old Testament, and they were trying to figure it out. In the Mishnah, the Talmud, other Jewish writings, there's a Tosefta, there's the Midrashraba, there's writings of Philo and Josephus, they weren't rabbis, but they were Jewish teacher. Went through all of that material, every every bit of Jewish commentary that I could find, and they were asking, what is meant by the plurals? Let us make man in our image,

and they couldn't figure it out. Some rabbis were saying, oh, that's God speaking to angels. Another rabbis would say, no, it can't be. We're not made in the image of angels. Angels didn't help create us, and other rabbis were saying, well, it's like a king. When a king says, it pleases us to invade France, or something. I mean, that rabbis wouldn't say that. I'm making that up, but when the king says, it pleases us to have lunch or something. But the problem is, though, that happens in some cultures, in some languages, it's not found in the Hebrew Old Testament, it's not found in the Hebrew language, and so it would be kind of unprecedented.

So the rabbis basically contradicted one another and they couldn't come to a solution. I think the reason they couldn't come to a solution is that they didn't understand, or they didn't want to admit, that there could be three persons in the being of God, because it sounds like three gods then. See, that's the problem. They wanted to maintain that hero Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. But I think ultimately, looking back on Genesis 1, 2,6 now from the perspective of the New Testament, I think we have here inter-Trinitarian conversation. I think we have deliberation where the Father is saying to the Son and the Holy Spirit, let us make man an our image. We don't know that just from that verse, but we see it now looking back from the perspective of the New Testament. It helps us understand it more fully. In fact, having said that, I would even go back earlier in Genesis. The second, okay, first verse of the Bible, in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, and then the second verse, and the earth was without form and void, and darkness was on the face of the earth, and the spirit of God was hovering on the face of the waters. See, now I don't think the Jewish people, when they first read that back in the time of Moses, I don't think they knew quite what meant by the Spirit of God, but now from the New Testament perspective looking back, I think also that was the Holy Spirit, in his role of preserving and sustaining the earth, even when it was first formed. So we get some partial revelation of the Trinity and the Old Testament. There are other passages like that. Genesis 3.22, the Lord God said, behold, the man has become like one of us knowing good and evil. Now, Lesti, reach out his hand and take also the tree of life and eat and live forever, and then just skipping around to some other passages in the Old Testament. Isaiah 6.8, I heard the voice, the Lord said, whom shall I send and whom will and who will go for us? Again, speaking God, speaking of himself in the plural, or here's an interesting passage in Psalm 45, your throne, O God, is forever and ever. The sceptre of your kingdom is a sceptre of uprightness. You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness. Therefore, God, your God has anointed you. Wait a minute. Your throne, O God, is forever and ever. Therefore, God has anointed you with the oil of gladness above your companion. How can the psalmist be saying, your throne, O God, is forever? Therefore, God has anointed you as if the person he's speaking to is called God, and another person is called God. Kind of a puzzle. Again, I think there's plurality hinted at in the Trinity. And of course, this verse is quoted in the book of Hebrews in the New Testament to apply to Christ. Hebrews 1.8, but of the sun, he says, now hear the author of Hebrews goes back and interpret Psalm 45 for us. He quotes it, but of the sun, he says, your throne, O God, is forever and ever. It's picking up Psalm 45 verse 6. This is just a quotation. And the Hebrews is saying, this is spoken of the sun. Psalm 110 verse 1, the Lord says, to my Lord, sit at my right hand until I make your enemies your footstool. Now, again, I don't know how fully David understood this, but I think what is happening is David, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, is somehow saying the Lord, that is God the Father, said to my Lord, said to my Lord, sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a stool for your feet. From the benefit of the New Testament, I'm looking and I'm thinking what is going on is the Father is saying to the sun, sit at my right hand, I don't know if it was just the Holy Spirit giving David these words to say and David was just pondering what they meant, or David had some hint of what they meant. I don't know, but there it is in Psalm 110. And Jesus quotes this in his disputes with Jewish leaders, the Pharisees who were attacking him and criticizing him, the Pharisees were gathered together. Jesus asked them a question saying, what do you think about the Christ, whose son is he? They said to him the son of David. He said to them, how is it then that David, here he's talking about David, in the Spirit, calls him Lord, saying, the Lord said to my Lord, and I think Jesus knew that this meant the Father says to the sun. So now take out my brackets here. David in the Spirit calls him Lord, saying, the Lord says to my Lord, sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet, if David thus calls him Lord, how is he his son and no one was able to answer him a word. So he's saying, David is calling the Messiah, his Lord, well how can he come from David then? And they couldn't figure that out. Of course the answer is that the Messiah is going to be both God and man, but the Pharisees didn't understand that. And that was Jesus. Isaiah 63, 10 is another passage from the Old Testament, but they rebelled and grieved his Holy Spirit. Therefore, he turned to be their enemy. His Holy Spirit implies that the Holy Spirit is distinct from God the Father. And if the Holy Spirit is grieved, that's a personal activity or a personal attribute of being grieved. And so it indicates there's a distinct personality or a distinct personhood of the Holy Spirit. Malachi 3, 1 to 2, behold, I send my messenger and he will prepare the way before me. And the Lord whom you seek will suddenly come to his temple. And so God is saying the Lord whom you seek will suddenly come to his temple. Behold, he is coming, says the Lord of hosts. So the Lord of hosts is saying that the Lord is coming, speaking of another person who is called Lord in the third person. He was Ozea 17. I will have mercy on the house of Judah and I will save them by the Lord their God. God speaking again. And so what is this? What are these hints of the doctrine of the Trinity? And here's perhaps a verse that in Isaiah 48 has three persons involved in it. Draw near to me here this, from the beginning, I have not spoken in secret. From the time it came to be, I have been there. And now the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit. This is the servant of the Lord who is saying the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit. And if we understand the servant of the Lord ultimately also to be God himself, then the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit. I didn't just let me look again here at Isaiah 48, 16, just a moment. I'm sorry, this is, yeah, this is the Lord himself speaking. Listen to me, O Jacob, in Israel, whom I called, I am he, I am the first, I am the last, my hand laid the foundation of the earth, my right hand spread out the heavens. When I called to them, they stand forth together. I assemble all of you and listen, who among them has declared these things. The Lord loves him. He shall perform his purpose. I have spoken, I have called him. I have brought him, drawn near to me here this. I have not spoken in secret. And now the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit. It's a question of whether the quotation ends from the Lord here and who is speaking, but at least there's someone who is being sent by the Lord and his Spirit is someone distinct from that. Well, those are hints, hints of plurality of persons in the Old Testament. Now there's a more complete revelation of the Trinity and the New Testament. So what we have is, we're going through the Bible, and there are hints, but people could have said, hmm, I wonder what that means. Why is God speaking the plural? But they didn't know. Well, we get to the New Testament, we get more complete understanding and that these, then we find out there are three persons in God, and they are called Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And there are a number of passages that do this, that have all three persons of the Trinity involved. Matthew 13, 16 to 17, when Jesus was baptized, immediately he went up from the water, behold, the heavens were open to him and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and coming to rest on him, and behold a voice from heaven, and that's God the Father saying, this is my beloved Son with whom I am well pleased. No, you have three persons here. You have Jesus being baptized, and you have the Holy Spirit descending on him like a dove, and you have God the Father speaking from heaven saying, this is my beloved Son. So you get Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It in one moment, and each person doing something different, God the Father speaking, Jesus being baptized in the Holy Spirit coming upon him. Or Matthew 28 and 19, go there forward and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and in the Greek text here, the construction shows that it's in the one name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit three persons. First Corinthians 12, 4 to 6, there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit, and there are varieties of service but the same Lord, and there are varieties of activities, but it's the same God who empowers them all in every one. What we get here in this verse is one passage that shows a pattern in the New Testament where the word Lord is generally applied to God the Son, and the word God is generally applied to God the Father. It's not a hundred percent of the time, but it's generally that way. In the New Testament, usually this word God, which in Greek is Theos, T-H-E-O-S, that's usually applied to God the Father, and this word Lord, which in Greek is K-Y-R-I-O-S, Kurios, that's generally applied to God the Son, not a hundred percent because there are seven or eight times where the word Theos God is applied to the Son. But generally, this is the pattern. And I remember earlier in my Christian life, I thought, oh, there are only seven or eight verses that call Jesus God in the New Testament, but I didn't realize that this word Lord or Kurios is applied over two hundred times to Jesus in the New Testament, and this Greek word, this Greek word Lord. If you go back into the Old Testament, that Greek word Lord or Kurios, that's used

6,886 or something like that over 6,000 times, 6,800 times, approximately, to translate the Greek word, or the Hebrew word which is Yahweh or Jehovah, or it's just translated Lord in most of our English translations, because you have the word Lord and the word God in the Old Testament, both referring to God, and so this word is used for Lord in the Old Testament over 6,800 times, and so when the New Testament calls Jesus Lord, it's not any diminishing of the idea that He is truly God. Does that make sense? Is that too? The word Lord echoes the Old Testament name for God, one of the two Old Testament names for God. That's what I'm trying to say.

So, Spirit, Lord, and God, three persons. Here we go. 2 Corinthians 13, 14, the grace of our Lord, Jesus Christ, and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. Here you have Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, all three in 2 Corinthians 3, 14, or Ephesians 4. There is one body and one spirit, just as you were called, the one hope that belongs to your call, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is overall through all and in all. So, here we go, the Father and Lord being used generally of God the Son or of Christ and Spirit, all three persons in, again, one passage. Jude, 20 to 21, pray in the Holy Spirit. Keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord, Jesus Christ, that leads to eternal life. Again, three persons. Just mentioned, all three together, as if this was a normal, expected kind of thing. So, all I'm saying here is that where we had a hint of plurality of persons in God and the Old Testament, in the New Testament, a number of passages seem very comfortable speaking of God and Lord and Spirit in the same passage and thinking of them all in belonging in the same category and belonging together. Okay, that was an overview. Now, how do we, how do we put together this idea that there's three persons in one God and keep from guarding against mistakes? Well, three statements will summarize the biblical teachings and the three statements are going to be number one. God is three persons. Number two, each person is fully God and number three, there's one God. If we get all goals together, then we'll be doing fine. So, God is three persons. What this means is I'm arguing against the idea that God is just one person who acts in different ways. In the history of the church, there were some people who said, oh, wait a minute. We don't believe this three persons deal. You know, I had Mike and Evan John as examples of three different persons and they said, well, wait a minute. We don't believe that. We believe it's just one person who's acting in three different ways. Like, we could say Mike is a husband and then sometimes he's

website manager for our Christian essentials class and sometimes he's an airplane pilot acting three different ways, but it's just one person and and some people said, well, God is in three persons. In the Old Testament, he acted like a father and then in the New Testament gospels, he's like Jesus and then in the epistles, he acts like the Holy Spirit, but it's just one person acting in different ways or a person could be kind of in literature. We could say a person could be a farmer and the mayor of his town and a husband. So, he has different hats at different times, that kind of thing. Now, I want to say that's wrong that the Bible says there are three persons in God. So, God is three persons. The fact that God is three persons, each person of the Trinity is distinct from two other persons. I'm going to say that there is a group in the world today that doesn't believe this. It's called Oneness Pentecostals or Jesus only is kind of the way sometimes they're referred to. And they don't have, it's called the United Pentecostal Church, they're not part of the assemblies of God, they're not part of any other Pentecostal group. They were kicked out of the assemblies of God in 1913, 1914 or something like that, but they do hold that God is only one person. And the problem is you've got

it's a very simple solution. The most heresy, you know, they take one part of truth and make it into the whole truth, but they deny this idea of the biblical teaching. I think the force of it, they deny the idea that you've got persons interacting genuinely and they're three different persons in God. So let's see the evidence for that. In the beginning was the word. And the word was with God and the word was God. He was in the beginning with God. It's very interesting that with with God implies that the word, and we're going to learn later in that chapter that the word is Jesus. Let me read down in John 1. The word was with God if you're with someone that means you're not the same as the person. It's a distinct person. Okay, so there are two persons there. But then the word was God. How can that be? Well, John just states it. They're right at the first verse. John 17, 24, Jesus is praying, Father, I desire that they also whom you have given me, maybe with me where I am to see my glory that you have given me because you loved me before the foundation of the world. This is two different persons. The Father gave glory to the Son and the Father loved the Son. That's interpersonal interaction. That's not one person. That's two persons, one person relating to the other. So God is three persons. And again, first John 2.1, if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father. Jesus Christ the righteous, two different persons. Jesus is advocating or representing us before the Father. Hebrews 7.25, he is able to save to the uttermost those who draw near to God through him since he always lives to make intercession for them. Again, Jesus, whom we believe to be fully God, is praying to the Father for us. He's making intercession. That means there's personal interaction. There's two different persons. The Son is praying and the Father is hearing the prayers. That's two separate persons. John 14, 26, the helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name. He will teach you all things and bring to remembrance all that I have said to you. That's someone different from the Son. The Holy Spirit is sent by the Father. He will send the Father in my name. The Father will send him in Jesus' name. And so he's a distinct person. And Romans 827, he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. Once again, you have the Spirit interceding to the Father, making prayers to the Father that implies the Spirit and the Father are different. So back to this diagram, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, three distinct persons, and the Son can pray to the Father. The Father can send the Son. The Father sends the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit intercedes to the Father. There are interpersonal relationships there. Okay. Matthew 828, 19, go there for and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son of the Holy Spirit, three different names mentioned. And John 1426, Jesus says, it's your advantage that I go away, or if I do not go away, the helper will not come to you, but if I go, I will send him to you. So here now Jesus sends the Holy Spirit. We are at the Father sending the Holy Spirit. Now Jesus is sending the Holy Spirit. And so once again, there's a distinction of persons. If Jesus or the Son sends the Holy Spirit to us. First Corinthians 1426, varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit, varieties of service, the same Lord, varieties of activities, but the same God who empowers them all in every one, again three different persons named. Now the Holy Spirit is a distinct person and not just the power of God. There have been some people throughout the history of the church who said, well, you know, I can see that the Father and Son are different, but I don't get this business about the Holy Spirit. Some people have said the Holy Spirit, he's just, that just means that's just a word for the breath or the wind or the power of God working in the world. And in fact, when I was in my doctoral work, the man who was the second reader on my PhD dissertation, Jeffrey Lampe, who was the regius professor of divinity or the head professor of divinity at the University of Cambridge, he didn't believe in the deity of the Holy Spirit. He was binitarian, not trainitarian. And different people throughout the history of the earth have said this. They say, well, I don't think the Holy Spirit is a distinct person. The problem is there are many passages that speak of the Holy Spirit in personal terms. And it's good for us to hear these because I think that sometimes we tend to think of the Holy Spirit just as an it or just as a force or just as kind of an impersonal power that can empower us. And in fact, the Holy Spirit in the Bible has talked about as a person with with activities that belong to personhood that he is carrying out. So Ephesians 4, 4, to 6, there is one body and one spirit just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call, Lord, one faith, one baptism. So I don't think that this verse is supposed to be in here because I cannot figure out how it's proving what I will skip that verse. I just have to make a note. I don't know what happened here. Next one works. John 1426, the helper of the Holy Spirit whom the Father will send in my name. He will teach you. That's a personal activity. The Holy Spirit teaches people all things. And he will bring to your remembrance all that I've said to you. That's a personal activity. The Holy Spirit works in the apostles to enable them to remember what Jesus has said. Or John 1426, the helper, when the helper comes, he will bear witness about me. He's called the helper or paraclete. That's a personal activity that comes to help us. And he bears witness. That's a personal activity. Someone bears witness to someone else. The wind or a forest doesn't do that. There's testimony that he bears. The Holy Spirit helps us in our weakness. He intercedes for us with bronings too deep for words. The Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. That means understanding our needs and helping our prayers as we come before God. That's a personal activity. The Spirit searches everything. First Corinthians 210, even the depths of God. I think that we were talking about the attributes of God for the last several weeks. We just understood a really tiny, tiny, tiny bit of the wonder and excellence of who God is. But here, Paul is saying the Holy Spirit searches everything. And he knows every aspect of the depths of God and understands. And so I think again, that's a personal activity of the Holy Spirit. Or here in Acts 16, 6 to 7, Paul and his traveling companions are going through freaky and galatia having been forbidden by the Holy Spirit to speak the word in Asia. And when they had come up to Missia, they attempted to go into Bethinia, but the Spirit of Jesus, which is another word for the Holy Spirit in their phrase, did not allow them. So the Holy Spirit says to go here and then says, no, don't go there. That's a personal action of the Holy Spirit relating to Paul and the others as persons. The Spirit said to Philip, go over and join this chariot. That's again personal activity. The Holy Spirit as a person. And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Well, that means the Holy Spirit can be grieved or troubled by what we do. I was reading this morning about Solomon and he at the end of his life tragically, Solomon had these many wives who turned away his heart to worship other gods and serve them. And said the Lord was angry with Solomon. Well, that's a personal kind of attitude towards Solomon that God had at that time of the Old Testament. And now again here, it's saying the Holy Spirit himself can have a sorrow or a grief at us if we do things that go contrary to his will. And that's a personal activity that is a person we have offended, not just a force or power. There are a number of passages that would not make sense if the Holy Spirit is just called the power of God. For instance, Luke 14, 14, and Jesus returned in the power of the Spirit to Galilee. Well, if the Holy Spirit were just a power, you would have to say this means the Holy Spirit returned in the power of the power of God to Galilee. That doesn't wouldn't make any sense. The Holy Spirit is different from the power of God. God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. Well, if the Holy Spirit is just a power or a force, it would say God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with power and with power. That doesn't, it would be redundant. So the Holy Spirit is a distinct person. Now, what about 2 Corinthians 3, 17? This is kind of a puzzling passage. It says, now the Lord is the Spirit and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. The Lord is the Spirit. What is going on here? If we take the idea that in the New Testament, Lord is often the word applied to the Son, and is it saying the Son is the Holy Spirit? Is this verse denying all those other passages that show a distinction of persons between the Son and the Holy Spirit? I don't think so. I think we have to seek another understanding for that passage. And just as I said, generally, the word God has applied to the Father, but sometimes it's applied to the Son. So I think here, generally, the word Lord has applied to the Son, but here's a time where I think it is saying something like this. You've been reading your Old Testament. You read about the Lord did this, and the Lord did that, and the Lord did this, and the Lord did that, and Paul is saying when you read that, realize that the Lord is God himself, and that is the Spirit. That is, that the Holy Spirit is the Lord you read about in the Old Testament, or is the God of the Old Testament. So I think it's just saying that the Holy Spirit is God or is divine and not mixing up the persons of the Trinity, but just not following strict consistency in terms of how the word Lord is applied. But if you have more thoughts on that passage, you can let me know.

But I think it just means that God is the Spirit as well as God is the Son and God is the Father. Okay, so now all that was to say, I don't know how many slides I have to go back, I was saying there are three statements that summarize the biblical teaching.

Did I not give you an outline today? It's too late now. No, it's not copied yet. It won't get back here until the class is over. I can't believe I did this. I walked in and talked to everybody. But you're following with me, right? Okay, and you're not going to be here the 20th. We'll have extra copies on the 20th. You're going to buy the book. Okay, well, okay, we're tracking. We're tracking. All right, so and one of I said, three statements summarize the biblical teaching. First, you're not wondering why you were paying so close attention to it. Oh, finding out. Okay. Number one, God is three persons. Okay, that's so Father, Son, Holy Spirit, they're sending, they're praying, they're interseeing, they're relating to one another and they're through and the Holy Spirit is a distinct person. All right, that's that's number one statement number two is each person is fully God. Now this, I'm saying this to say, to overcome the idea that God is just Father and then there are these lesser beings called Son and Holy Spirit. That basically, that's a heresy called Aryanism, that the Son was created and the Holy Spirit was created and really Father just got that that's not true. What I want to say in these passages is each person is fully God and here's where it gets tricky. If if this represents God, then how much of this circle is the Father? If the Father is fully God, then the whole circle is the Father, okay. Then how much of this circle is the Son? The whole circle is the Son. The Son is fully God and if the Holy Spirit is fully God, then the whole circle is the Holy Spirit. And you say, wait a minute. I thought you said three distinct persons. I did. That's what makes it hard. How can there be three distinct persons? But each person is the whole being. That's the puzzle. But let's look at what these passages say. And see, I think what happened was the church sort of went through these passages and said, huh, we'll look at this, look at this, look at this. And the church keeps driving to this idea that there are three persons. We can't get around that. That's really clear. Is there doing distinct things? They're relating to each other. And now we get these passages that say, wait a minute, each of these persons is fully God. And here's where these passages go. I don't know if we'll get through all of these today. But first, God the Father is clearly God. And he's the one in the beginning God created heavens and earth. And nobody is going to argue with that. And I'm not going to give hundreds of passages about God, our Father, et cetera. But number two, the Son is fully God. Is there evidence for that? Yes, in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God. There's distinction. And the Word was God. There's identity. The Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through him without him was not anything made that was made. He's creating. And he was life. And the life was life was the light of men. I could go into some detail. I don't think I'll do that now. But I've got in my sister mythology book in a long, long, two or three paragraph, footnote. And the Word was God in Greek. The Joe was witnesses translate this. The word was a God. Small G. There's a Greek grammar question here. A technical question of Greek grammar. They say, wait a minute, this definite article, the is not before they asked before God. The reason is it shows in Greek that it's the predicate of the sentence. The word was God. And that's the way Greek does that. And I'm not going to go into detail about that now. But just to say that if Joe was witnesses argue about that with you, just so you can be, you have to look up some literature for arguments about it. And I've got some in the systematic theology book or there are other books that respond to them. But don't be afraid that they have any scholarly evidence on their side. They don't. There's no Greek grammarian in history that I know that has sided with them other than Joe was witnesses themselves. And it was about lesson six when I taught first year Greek grammar that we came to how you indicate the predicate that in a sentence with a linking verb. It's not like a huge complicated argument. A complicated or uncertain grammatical rule. But I think I'll go on. It does say the word was God and it clearly says that and you can stand on that. And the question ultimately ends up who is the God that is being talked about in the context. And it's the God who created the heavens and the earth. It's the God who sent John the Baptist to proclaim that the Lord is coming. John 2028 and 30 and 31. This is near the end of John's gospel. Thomas answered him, my Lord and my God. This is Jesus appearing to Thomas and saying, you know, and showing him the wounds in his hands and sides that touched me. And Thomas says, my Lord and my God. And now John, Jesus approves of this as blessed, blessed are he blesses Judas and blesses Thomas for saying this. And then it says, Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples which are not written in this book. But these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God and that by believing you may have life in his name. This is really the dramatic climax of John's gospel where Jesus died, rose from the dead, and then he appears to disciples and then he appears to doubting Thomas. And Thomas when he sees Jesus risen from the dead says, my Lord and my God, he calls Jesus his God and Jesus approves of this and then basically Jesus says, I want everybody else to do this. I didn't print these verses. Jesus said to him, have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believed and John's point is that's going to be you readers. And then John says, this is the purpose of my gospel so that you would believe. It is, I wrote down all these signs or miracles so that you would be like Thomas and you would believe and that you would call Jesus my Lord and my God. That you may believe that Jesus is the Christ the Son of God and that by believing you might have life in his name. In other words, this is John saying, this is so important. I want you to have the same attitude toward Jesus and call him the Son of God or call him my Lord and my God. Titus 2.13, waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ. Here he is called our God and Savior, Romans 9.5 Christ, who is God overall blessed forever, amen. Paul calls Christ the one who is God overall. Isaiah 9.6 predicts that the Son to be born, the Son to us, a child is born, to us, a son is given, the government shall be on his shoulder, his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, mighty God, everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. That's a prediction of the Son to be born who will be called mighty God and then in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily, the whole fullness of God is in Christ. So the Son is fully God. Father is God, the Son is God and there are many, many other passages that where Jesus says, I am the way the truth in the life, I am the resurrection of the life or the book of Hebrews that says, you, Lord, founded the earth in the beginning, the heavens are the work of your hands, there are attributing creation to Christ, there are many other passages and I've just talked, I've just touched on some of them, but the evidence for the deity of Christ in the New Testament is abundant and overwhelming. Then the Holy Spirit is also fully God. This is very interesting, in the great commission for instance, go there for and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name, Ace Ta'anama means it's into the name and it's just one name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, that is the name is the quality or character of the person and there's one name of the Father and Son and the Holy Spirit, that is they all have the same character, the same quality. And just think how strange it would be, it just couldn't be that Jesus would say baptizing them into the name of the Father and the Son in the angel Gabriel,

couldn't do that, you can't put the angel Gabriel up there or the angel Michael or anything any other created being baptizing them into the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit puts the Holy Spirit on the same level as the Father and the Son. Varieties of gifts but the same Spirit and Spirit, Lord and God connected together in 1 Corinthians 12 and again 2 Corinthians 13, Lord Jesus Christ, love of God, the fellowship of the Holy Spirit connected together. Acts 5, 3 to 4, Peter said, Ananias, why is Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit? You have not lied to men but to God. In other words, to lie to the Holy Spirit is to lie to God. There's an identity there where the Holy Spirit is identified as God or 1 Corinthians 3 16 do not know that you are God's temple and that God's Spirit dwells in you. So again, how do you know that your God's temple? Well, God's Spirit dwells in you. That means God is dwelling in you. It's your God's temple. So what do we have? God is three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Father is God, the Son is God, the Holy Spirit is God. So each person is fully God. Well, if that's all we had, we'd say the three persons, each one's fully God. That's simple. There are three gods. I mean, that's kind of, if that's all we had, if we just have there are three different persons and each one is God, we'd say, okay, there are three gods. The problem is you get some passages in the Bible that say there is only one God. Hero Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Or first King's 860, the Lord is God, there is no other. There is just one God as they have 45, five to six. I am the Lord. There is no other besides me. There is no God. There is no other God besides me or righteous God and Savior. There is none beside me as they have 45, five and six and twenty one and twenty two. There is one God. First Timothy, two five. There is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. Romans 3.30 God is one. James 2.19, you believe that God is one. You do well. Even the demons believe and shudder. So how do we put that all together? Now, and there are some simplistic solutions. If you deny, some simplistic solutions must deny one strand of the biblical teaching. And see, these are the three things I have said. God is three persons. They relate to each other. Each person is fully God, a lot of verses there and there is one God, a lot of verses there. Now, if you took out the first one, you just denied that first statement. You just say, each person is fully God and there is one God. Well, then you don't have three persons anymore. You just got one person in God and that doesn't work. Or if you deny that each person is fully God, then you get this picture where you got a sun and spirit being created beings and they're not fully God. That's their whole witness as you believe that. The sun is created. And, or you deny that there is one God, then you get three gods, but that doesn't really give us a good solution either. So what we do, we have to have all three of those statements together. And the question is, how can that be? We don't know anything like this. How can we understand this? I will take a minute or two before we get out because now what I want to do next time we come together is look at these mistakes that people have made. What's called subbellionism or modalism. It's called arianism. Some of these mistakes that people made in trying to understand or explain this and probably take some analogies. And then finally try to explain how is it that the persons of the Trinity relate to the being of God? Is there any way we can understand it? So we'll try to put that together next time. But do you have a couple of just comments or questions right now? EG? Good question. Good. Act practical question. Which person should you pray to? Yeah. Does it make any difference? Whether you want to make any difference. Well, short answer is it's okay to pray to any one of the members of the Trinity. Or sometimes we just pray to God generally. And that's okay too. But Jesus prayed to the Father a lot. There are examples where when Stephen was dying, he said, Lord Jesus received my spirit. He was praying to Jesus. And Maranatha, our Lord come, I think is a prayer to Jesus or when the disciples were, they were choosing a new new apostle to replace Judas. Lord show which one of these you have chosen. I think they're praying to Jesus. Even so, Lord Jesus come quickly. Those are prayers to Jesus. And Jesus is the great high priest who understands so we should pray to him. There aren't any explicit prayers to the Holy Spirit and the New Testament. But I don't, the Holy Spirit intercedes for us in Romans 8. And I just, we shouldn't grieve the Holy Spirit. He teaches. He leads. I think surely we can talk to him. He is God and there's nothing wrong with speaking to him and in specific situations praying for his power or direction. So, good question.

Many years ago, I heard the analogy of water used to explain the Trinity and that was helpful to me. What do you think about that analogy? Yeah, because water can be steam or water or ice. Right. Okay. And it's all H2O. It's just in various forms. Yeah. The problem is, maybe it's a little bit helpful, but the problem is that it doesn't all have the same characteristics, but each person in the Trinity has the same attributes. I mean, if it's steam, but that's not the big problem. The big problem is there are two problems. One is, if you take a drop of water, it's not at the same time ice. That is, I want to say that God, the sun is fully God, but that drop of water is only part of the water you've got. Some of it's ice and some of it's steam. It's not all the water. I've got an ice cube and a drop of water and a jar of steam. There are three different beings basically. Okay, so you can't different properties. The person's different properties, but they're not the one being.

Yeah, there's something like that, but they're not all the same being. That is, they're not the same at the same time. Yeah. And the other problem is ice cube and drop of water and steam are not persons. So it's just, it's just, yeah, yeah, it's what I'm going to say about those analogies all help us a little bit, but they all break down. Yeah. Okay. What else? What? One what? God is one what? Three who's? One what? Three who's? Oh, one what and three who's? Yeah, that's true. One being and three persons. But each person is this is all the one what?

In your opinion, why do you think Jesus had to leave before the Holy Spirit could come?

God planned it that way. I'm not sure. Well, one thing was that Jesus, while he was on earth, was one place at one time because he was in a human body, but the Holy Spirit is every place. So that's, that's one one thing, but I'm, I'm not sure of all the reasons. Just God planned that would be the way things would happen. So anything else? Yeah, John.

It seems as though, say again, yeah. It seems that the Bible, when it repeats itself a lot, is something that we're to really pay attention to and get. And it also seems as though it makes a point of calling Jesus all the different designations, calls the Father, all the different designations, calls the Holy Spirit, all the different designations. Many many of them anyway. I guess this is just an observation. I mean, you've just pointed it out. Yeah, so so that if the word God and Lord and God and Lord can both be as of any memory. Just have to take it that way. Yeah, okay. And so, okay, John, what the church did for the 300 years is it says, okay, it says that there's three persons, says each one is God, says is one God. So we believe it where they got to trouble was thinking about it more and try, how can this be? Because every time I know three different persons, there are three different beings. See, you and Kathy and John, there are three different persons. So, so that's how you try to put it together. And then people started giving explanations for how it could work and when they gave explanations, they got in trouble. So all right, Sandy.

I heard Dallas Willard once say in speaking about the mystery, really, of the Trinity, that God is two, three to be one, but two, one to be three. Well, how would you respond to that? Well, sure. I mean, it's just, yeah, there's oneness and threeness. But don't you think that part of this is we take our, our creaturely rational minds and we extend out as far as we can and we come up against the wall of the mystery of who God, the creator is and that there's a sense of which after we've done all we can to understand and read all this scripture in the original languages and read all the commentaries that we have to bow and acknowledge that this is an area of mystery. Yeah, helpful, Sandy. And that's, I mean, I'll just tell you where, where I'm going is that every time we try to understand a little bit more and give an example, we say, no, it doesn't work. It doesn't work. Finally, we say, we don't know anything like this. And then I'm going to say, yes, that's right. God is different. And so we have to worship him and he is different. Let's, let's, I'm going to pray here, but I'm, I, I resolved to myself not to go late and I've gone late again. I'm sorry, but will you hurry and make up for the lateness so we don't walk in late because God's going to be leading worship over here. Okay, let's pray. Lord, God, we give you thanks, Father, Son and Holy Spirit for the excellence of your being and that you give us, certainly Lord, these words in, in the Bible to help us to understand who you are. Lord, help us to, to understand and also to bow and wonder and adoration, give thanks to you for the excellence of your being in Jesus name. Amen. Thank you.